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Slim

Joined: 05 Mar 2006
Posts: 6713
Location: New England (In the US of A)

Posted: Sun Jun 22, 25 8:31 pm Post subject:
I've got two apps on my phone, one specifically for the company that we get free rapid charging for another 10 months or so (promo deal with the car purchase) and another that seems to be cross compatible with most every EV charging station I come across.

Mistress Rose

Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 16750

Posted: Mon Jun 23, 25 3:52 pm Post subject:
I expect that like computers, it will sort itself out. In the early days of desk top computers, one make of computer wouldn't 'talk' to printers, or anything else belonging to another make. Now virtually all are interchangeable.

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28389
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Sun Jun 29, 25 2:12 pm Post subject:

Battery claims
The following link is to the complete list of claims I have been compiling.

https://martindavidwalker.blogspot.com/2024/09/battery-claims.html

The new claims in the last week are as follows.
June 27th 2025, GM working on three new battery technologies
GM are working on Solid-state state, Sodium and Lithium Manganese Rich batteries. All of that has been reported previously but it does emphasise that not only do they recognise the future is in batteries but also the importance of vertical integration.
I'm happy to be corrected but 5 years ago it felt to me like legacy auto were having to scrabble around for batteries probably paying through the nose for the worst batteries.

https://www.arenaev.com/general_motors_is_working_on_three_new_battery_technologies_solidstate_is_one_of_them-news-4852.php
June 27th 2025, Vanadium Redox Flow batteries for grid storage
Less an claim and more an â€œinformationalâ€ that there are lots of alternatives to Lithium when it comes to grid storage. All batteries have specific properties and the super power of Vanadium Redox Flow batteries is long term storage.
https://www.ft.com/content/babd683d-5a74-4076-82a4-9db304f45f73
June 27th 2025, longer life Zinc ion batteries
Claims of a 5000 cycle life and hence a contender for grid storage.

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-025-60558-y

June 24th 2025, Quantumscape speeds up solid-state production
These are lithium metal solid-state batteries entering an advanced sampling phase. Based on earlier press releases these would be 300wh/kg energy density.

https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20250624801952/en/QuantumScape-Achieves-Major-Milestone-Cobra-Separator-Process-Enters-Baseline-Production

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 44721
Location: yes

Posted: Sun Jun 29, 25 6:07 pm Post subject:
at least a few of the options will become useful

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28389
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Sun Jul 06, 25 1:41 pm Post subject:

Battery claims
The following link is to the complete list of claims I have been compiling.

https://martindavidwalker.blogspot.com/2024/09/battery-claims.html

The new claims in the last week are as follows.
July 5th 2025, Chery backed company samples solid-state batteries
This again is a â€œwe have a production lineâ€ claim with promises of progressing from 300wh/kg to 400wh/kg and then to 500wh/kg. Assuming accessible costs any of these numbers would be game changing.
A note on solid-state costs. I don't think it serves the interests of companies to not suggest initial prices will be high. Would CATL really want to say that in a couple of years you can have a 80kwh solid-state battery for the price of a 50kwh lithium ion battery now? They are not going to say that! But obviously raw materials costs would have likely reduced.

https://carnewschina.com/2025/07/04/first-batch-of-solid-state-batteries-from-chery-backed-company-produced-in-china/

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28389
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Sun Jul 06, 25 1:41 pm Post subject:

Battery claims
The following link is to the complete list of claims I have been compiling.

https://martindavidwalker.blogspot.com/2024/09/battery-claims.html

The new claims in the last week are as follows.
July 5th 2025, Chery backed company samples solid-state batteries
This again is a â€œwe have a production lineâ€ claim with promises of progressing from 300wh/kg to 400wh/kg and then to 500wh/kg. Assuming accessible costs any of these numbers would be game changing.
A note on solid-state costs. I don't think it serves the interests of companies to not suggest initial prices will be high. Would CATL really want to say that in a couple of years you can have a 80kwh solid-state battery for the price of a 50kwh lithium ion battery now? They are not going to say that! But obviously raw materials costs would have likely reduced.

https://carnewschina.com/2025/07/04/first-batch-of-solid-state-batteries-from-chery-backed-company-produced-in-china/

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28389
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Sun Jul 27, 25 3:41 pm Post subject:

Battery claims
The following link is to the complete list of claims I have been compiling.

https://martindavidwalker.blogspot.com/2024/09/battery-claims.html

The new claims in the last week are as follows.
July 23rd 2025, Farasis setting up production to start sampling solid-state batteries by the end of 2025
The batteries are claimed to be 400wh/kg.
At this point to be a solid-state sceptic means you think at least 7 companies are just spouting hyperbole.
https://www.electrive.com/2025/07/22/farasis-to-launch-pilot-production-of-solid-state-batteries-by-end-of-2025/
July 5th 2025, Chery backed company samples solid-state batteries
This again is a â€œwe have a production lineâ€ claim with promises of progressing from 300wh/kg to 400wh/kg and then to 500wh/kg. Assuming accessible costs any of these numbers would be game changing.
A note on solid-state costs. I don't think it serves the interests of companies to not suggest initial prices will be high. Would CATL really want to say that in a couple of years you can have a 80kwh solid-state battery for the price of a 50kwh lithium ion battery now? They are not going to say that! But obviously raw materials costs would have likely reduced.

https://carnewschina.com/2025/07/04/first-batch-of-solid-state-batteries-from-chery-backed-company-produced-in-china/

Slim

Joined: 05 Mar 2006
Posts: 6713
Location: New England (In the US of A)

Posted: Tue Jul 29, 25 12:41 pm Post subject:

Part of me feels compelled to jump for another EV to replace my 2010 daily driver.
Currently seeing the end to a federal $7,500 tax credit, and who knows how long I could continue to expect the opportunity to be able to double that with a state rebate, AND the new tax law over here makes auto loan interest deductible from above the line income for federal taxes for the next few years (yes, our tax system is dumb, and fraught with odd incentives and complications).

But even with all of that, a new car (EV or ICE) is still quite an expense. I can probably keep my current car going another couple years before the rust and repairs make it completely untenable, but I'm not sure if the new battery tech will have brought EV prices down enough by then to make that the better choice.....

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28389
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Tue Jul 29, 25 1:18 pm Post subject:

Slim wrote:

but I'm not sure if the new battery tech will have brought EV prices down enough by then to make that the better choice.....

whilst the battery is a significant expense, it's now far from being the massive factor it once was, so further battery price reductions won't drive down costs massively.
I strongly suspect that in most the world production price parity has already happened.
There are afterall sub $10,000 halfway decent EVs in China.
What will change is ranges increasingly being what people need and the self driving tech ramping massively.
In three years time that is going to be the decision people have to make rather than worrying about battery type.

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28389
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Sun Aug 10, 25 2:03 pm Post subject:

Battery claims
The following link is to the complete list of claims I have been compiling.

https://martindavidwalker.blogspot.com/2024/09/battery-claims.html

The new claims in the last week are as follows.
August 8th 2025, A second life for EV batteries
It's been slow on the new battery development news front, so how about some old batteries?
Cheap grid storage is crucial to eliminating fossil fuel from electricity generation and old EV batteries can play a role.
Personally I don't think it's a vital role. I think sodium batteries are going to start ramping up massively and will be common place in houses in just a few years.

https://www.canarymedia.com/articles/long-duration-energy-storage/second-life-ev-grid-batteries-succeed

August 6th 2025, AI discovers potential battery materials
Normally I stay away from lab experiments and this is barely even in the lab. However AI and materials science is an area that's going to be a thing hence raising awareness of it is important.

https://www.independent.co.uk/tech/battery-breakthrough-ai-artificial-intelligence-material-b2801685.html

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 44721
Location: yes

Posted: Mon Aug 11, 25 12:05 pm Post subject:

second use of batteries is not new, it is a good idea if it can be done safely and easily, both of which seem to be planned in by the folk trying it

it might be best to try second use battery tech in an "industrial setting" before pulling the battery out of a write off car and popping it in the utility room

my comparison is historic tech using an old style lead acid car battery after it is a bit tired for turning a starter on a chilly morning or better still an almost new battery from a scrapped vehicle, it might not be short duration high current any more but it holds and releases leccy fairly well
+ solar 12V or 28V PV rig
+leccy fence kit

= a low work, low cost, long life means to have no piggies in the pumpkins or coos scratching on the mobile chook house corners

other uses for 12 and 28 V are available, a reused lighter socket and plug will run lots of stuff direct( maybe with a few bits of leccy engineering components)
an inverter is a huge energy loss but can make 230V (best to use low V kit)
for low V kit the leccy engineering is mostly off the shelf stuff, maybe a few wires and a good meter

ps no reason to not take low V to extra high V if you need to , solid state kit can get up from a 3 volts to 20 KV in a single step so long as low amps is ok, ideal for a cheap camera flash or fly swatting bat,
12V to 7000V for a leccy fence is very off the shelf kit

a decent wimshurst machine and a leyden jar is scarily good for low tech harvest and storage of extra high V with a dangeroos amperage

other daftness is available

pps i have only ever had one 20000V shock with a dangeroos amperage, after that i mended stuff sitting on a wooden stool placed in a plastic washing up bowl

it threw me across a room over a sofa and into the wall, after 15 mins i regained consciousness, and ached a lot for several months
i recon i was quite lucky to get away with that bad mistake

Mistress Rose

Joined: 21 Jul 2011
Posts: 16750

Posted: Tue Aug 12, 25 6:17 am Post subject:

Another way is the 'hand in the pocket' method. Only use one hand so that the shock doesn't pass through the important parts of the body.

A few irrelevant bits; husband got called to a swarm of bees in a switching station locally as he has worked on high voltage and was a beekeeper. Nobody else in the beekeepers would go there.

I was at school with, I think the grandson (possibly great grandson) of the man that invented the Wimshurst machine. I think the original was taken to the Repair Shop a while back by this man's son for sorting out. We used that to light a Bunsen burner through several people when I was at school. Each person stood on a block of paraffin wax holding hands, one touching machine and last one near bunsen burner. Gas turned on once charge going and managed to light it. One of the boys had long hair (1960s style) and it stood on end with the static charge. All rather amusing.

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28389
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Sun Aug 24, 25 12:59 pm Post subject:

Battery claims
The following link is to the complete list of claims I have been compiling.

https://martindavidwalker.blogspot.com/2024/09/battery-claims.html

The new claims in the last week are as follows.
August 19th 2025, Hyundai patents a way of using copper in solid-state batteries
Copper is cheaper than Nickel or stainless steel, but suffers corrosion issues. What is notable is companies pursuing improvements in technology that hasn't even hit the market yet. I see it as a strike against those still thinking solid-state is at least 5 years away.
https://www.electrive.com/2025/08/18/hyundai-patents-breakthrough-for-copper-use-in-solid-state-batteries/
August 19 2025, CATL Naxtra sodium ion batteries
Imagine a very cheap, very long life sodium ion battery with 175wh/kg energy density, the same density as current LFP batteries at a cost that is $20 a kwh and decreasing.
I'm not including a link as all I read on this poor journalism.
But it takes little imagination to see this as a game changer for grid storage. If it is half the price of LFP and lasts twice as long you can see the implications. Those are my more conservative figures than what I have read, but even if you think I'm still exaggerating it's still remarkable.
Sodium has advantages over Lithium in terms of both working better at low temperatures and in the old chestnut of fire risk.

dpack

Joined: 02 Jul 2005
Posts: 44721
Location: yes

Posted: Mon Aug 25, 25 10:36 am Post subject:
good, tis nice to know a variety of tweaked tech is better faster than predicted have we got to the doubling/halving a year stage yet? twice as much for half the price would be nice

jema
Downsizer Moderator

Joined: 28 Oct 2004
Posts: 28389
Location: escaped from Swindon

Posted: Sun Oct 26, 25 12:18 pm Post subject:

Battery claims
The following link is to the complete list of claims I have been compiling.

https://martindavidwalker.blogspot.com/2024/09/battery-claims.html

The new claims are as follows.
October 23rd 2025, another low cost high cycle life sodium ion battery
These batteries are good for 10,000 cycles. That would be 15 years of fully cycling a battery twice a day and twice a day isn't at all a likely scenario.

https://www.ess-news.com/2025/10/22/alsym-energy-launches-na-series-claiming-safe-low-cost-sodium-ion-battery-storage/
October 23rd 2025, The sodium ion battery revolution has started
We've been hearing about sodium ion developments for a few years now, but I think that there's been a bit of a â€œmissing in actionâ€ perception of them. This article goes a way to showing they are getting into things.

https://cleantechnica.com/2025/10/22/the-sodium-ion-battery-revolution-has-started/
October 22nd 2025, chery unveils 600 wh/kg at cell level solid state battery
Not seeing solid information on cost or mass production, but that's more than twice the energy density of most current batteries at pack level.
The consensus has been that solid-state state means expensive, it's not a view that I've particularly agreed with as so much depends on whether production processes are much different to current batteries. But at some point less materials does mean less cost.

https://carnewschina.com/2025/10/19/chery-unveils-600-wh-kg-solid-state-battery-module-targeting-1300-km-range/#google_vignette
October 22nd 2025, a lightweight electric motor
It's been a very lean month for battery developments, so let's expand out a little. What matters with EVs is range and that's very much about weight. But weight isn't only about the battery.

https://insideevs.com/news/776572/yasa-axial-flux-motor-new-power-density-record/
September 30th 2025, New cell to pack material can dramatically increase energy density
It's not just the energy density at cell level that matters. It's the energy density of the battery pack. The claim here is up to 50% more density at pack level and that the technology is independent of battery chemistry. I have to say I'm a little sceptical as current packs generally double as being structural to the car, e.g. the extra material serves a purpose. But as I'm constantly saying we are at the point with car batteries where small increases are game changers. A car with 225 miles range is still a city EV, a 25% increase makes that more than 280 miles which makes for a respectable general purpose car. A 250 miles range EV would get more than 310 and a 300 mile range car becomes 375 miles.

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/technology/radical-new-ev-battery-boosts-range-50-no-size-increase
September 24th 2025, Stellantis announces integrated battery pack
IBIS which stands for Intelligent Battery, Integrated System incorporates inverter and charger into the battery pack reducing weight. This reduces losses and weight by 40kg. It would also clearly reduce development costs for car manufacturers. To me it highlights that it's not all about the battery chemistry.

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